Steve Otis Gunn: A Tale of Two Steves

Good afternoon, good morning, good evening.

Whatever time of day you're listening to this.

Now, this episode is going to be a little different than our usual weekly episode.

Some of you may think that I am new to podcasting.

You would be wrong.

Back in 2007, I ran something called a Sogcast.

This was a podcast primarily for me to showcase my music and projects that I was working on.

And I did three episodes, one of them in Billingham, which is quite close to where I live now, up here in the Northeast.

Another one from High Wycombe, which you'll hear some of today, and one from Japan.

Now I'll put a bit of it into this episode just as a kind of fun thing near the end.

But first of all, it's going to get even weirder because guess who the guest is this week?

You'll never guess.

It's me.

So let me explain.

I was actually working on a different episode, but I kind of ran out of time.

Now the reason for this is mainly that my wife contracted COVID and I've been having to look after the kids and sort of sleep on the floor in a different room.

And just all the things that go along with that have massively impacted my time, as well as one of my children being off sick from school.

So not to worry.

I have come up with a solution.

Now, I cannot lie, there are times when I do feel a little bit nutty, a little bit mad, a little bit not quite normal, whatever that means these days.

But this is probably not going to help because this episode is me talking to me.

So yeah, get ready for a weird one.

I decided I would ask myself some of the questions I ask other people and see how that turns out.

Turns out it's a bit weird, it's a bit nuts, but it's a lot of fun and it's just silly.

It's just a silly one.

It's going to be short.

This one's going to be like half an hour or something.

Okay, just go with it.

Consider it to be me losing my fucking tiny mind.

Okay, here I am talking to Steve Otis Gunn.

I hope you like it.

You know talking to yourself is a little bit weird, right?

Welcome to Television Times, a new podcast with your host, me, Steve Otis Gunn.

We'll be discussing television in all its glorious forms.

From my childhood, your childhood, the last ten years, even what's on right now.

So join me as I talk to people you do know and people you don't about what scared them, what inspired them and what made them laugh and cry here on Television Times.

Hi Steve, how are you doing?

Is your mic okay?

Yeah, yeah, I reckon.

The cable's a little loose, but I think I'll be alright.

Are you going to wear headphones or are you a headphones off kind of guy?

Yeah, I think I'll keep them on.

I mean, it's more professional, isn't it?

It also makes us feel like we're doing something important.

Yeah, which we're definitely not, by the way.

No, of course not.

Anyway, let's get straight into this week because I don't want to delay you because I know you're a busy man.

Oh, yes.

So do you mind if I just crack on and ask you the first question like right off the bat?

Let's go.

Yeah, yeah, that's totally fine.

Let's go for it.

Okay, let's do it the way I did it with a guest I cannot mention yet in Edinburgh.

Give me a number between 1 and 20 and I'll ask you that question.

14.

That's a really good one.

Okay, I like this one.

I haven't asked it a lot.

What invention from television would you bring to life?

Like something from like, you know, people say something, Doctor Who, whatever, that you would bring to life and actually, you know, be able to use?

Everybody's going to say Time Machine, right?

But I think for me, it would be Knight Rider.

You know, the car in Knight Rider, Kit.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course.

I believe it was KITT, Knight Industries 2000.

Something like that.

I loved that TV show.

I loved the voice of Kit.

I loved the way it would like, you know, propel, you know, David Hasselhoff out the sunroof, flying up to some building top.

It was really fun.

I loved that show.

I liked the silly, I think I had an English voice or one of those Americanized.

Hey, Michael.

Yeah, anglicized American voices that they use sometimes in American stuff like C-3PO kind of voice.

But yeah, I loved Knight Rider.

I think all they ever did though was like speed up the car footage to make it look like it was going fast.

But the idea that it was that kind of, you know, the dashboard had the kind of little, almost like a graphic equalizer effect you get on a phone now.

Just sort of up and down lights flashing.

I loved all that.

And in 1996, I went to Universal Studios, my first time in Los Angeles, and I sat in Knight Rider.

I sat in the car from the show, allegedly.

Really?

But that's also where I met fucking Beethoven and it turned out that dog died two years before, so maybe not, I don't know.

But yeah, I think it would be the car from Knight Rider.

Yeah, that's a really good answer.

I love Knight Rider too, obviously.

And I sort of...

the funny thing was I worked on...

People might not know, I think people do know, don't they?

I worked on Darren Brown's show.

And every time we'd be like in a theatre or whatever and we'd start the music, I always used to think it sounded like Knight Rider.

I can't distinguish them now.

I've got Knight Rider in my head right now.

I'd put them in here, but I'd have to pay copyright.

But you probably get the idea.

Oh, I do.

Yeah, really, really good answer.

Really good answer.

You ready for another one?

Absolutely.

Let's go for it.

Okay, pick another number.

Would you?

Between 1 and 20.

Five.

Let's go with five.

One, two, three, four, five.

Okay, this is one I ask a lot of people.

A TV show that scared the shit out of you.

Now, it can't be Salem's Lot because I know you've already mentioned that, haven't you?

In the actual episodes.

So do you have something else?

Well, I do, but I mean it is a film and I know you're going to have to press this.

But I have to say it because it's the biggest one and I did see it on TV.

It wouldn't have been at the cinema.

So let's hit that jingle.

No need to get out your phone for these videos were played at home and at the cinema no money was spent before they watched these films on a TV set.

Right, so it wasn't even a VHS or anything.

It would have just been on terrestrial television, but it was definitely, definitely, definitely The Child Catcher.

Jiggly Jiggly Bang Bang, which of course was every single Christmas.

He had that long nose, right?

I'm just talking about it.

It really makes me shudder.

It's just fucking disgusting.

Something about him and the sweets and the candies.

It just creeps me out to this day.

And I think his hair, like the hairstyle he had, if I saw anyone with that hairstyle as a kid, I associated it with some kind of like, you know, someone that would take me away.

Because when I grew up in like the 70s and 80s, everything on television was, you know, someone will come and take you away.

Someone will offer you something and drag you into their car.

Someone will give you sweets and take you off.

And there was no sort of mention of the things that were actually happening, like child molestation or anything like that.

It was just the fact that you would be taken away and you would never see your family again.

And I fucking hated that part of the film.

And even when it comes up now, I make my kids look away or I turn it off.

It was recently on and I had to keep going to a different channel and flicking through the ads and just waiting for that horrific scene to be over.

And it's going to go on for absolutely ever.

I hate it.

Absolutely fucking hate it.

Yeah, I think that's a pretty good show.

It's a terrible, terrible scene in a pretty fun, great film.

I mean, I love Chi Chi Bang Bang.

But yeah, I agree.

That scene is absolutely fucking nightmarish and goes straight into your dreams.

Anyway, I'm just going to pick another one for you.

I'm going to pick one.

I'm just going to get the piece of paper and see where I land.

What is a TV show that you would bring back from the dead?

A reboot of something from your childhood that you feel doesn't really get the praise that it deserves, really.

I don't know if it's happened, actually.

I don't know why I thought of this, but for some reason I immediately thought of Fort Boyard.

Do you remember that?

It was a TV show, a bit like The Crystal Maze.

I'm going to say late 90s, early 2000s.

It might be earlier than that.

I think it was Melinda Messenger and Lesley Grantham, I think, and they're running around some fucking weird chimney island-based thing in the Channel Islands or France or something.

I don't really understand where it was.

But it was like The Crystal Maze, but I really liked it.

It was probably really, really naff.

But yeah, game shows like that, they're really, really popular right now.

I think bring that back.

Bring back Fort Boyard.

Who would we get on it?

You'd get...

Who would you get?

You'd need someone really sarcastic and dry.

Someone like, maybe Tom Allen would be a good choice.

That's a good idea.

And then someone running around with all the contestants that would be, like, you know, really hating it.

So, yeah, maybe someone like Roisin Connerty.

Yeah, yeah.

Or Daisy May Cooper, people like that.

Someone that would really be quite grumpy about running around.

That would be quite funny.

Like a sarcastic E-Taskmaster version of Fort Boyard.

I think that would be great fun.

Bring it back.

I think it was Channel 5, wasn't it?

Yeah, yeah, it was.

The English version now.

Well, I will give you some fucking information here that I'm sure you don't know then.

There has been 30 French versions of this.

What?

30 seasons of Fort Boyard.

I don't think it ever went away.

It's still on.

There's a current season on French TV.

I mean, the English version has been gone for a while, but it might be time to bring that back.

In France, it's still a thing, still a big show.

There you go.

Channel 5, get on it.

Come on, let's go.

OK, I'm going to ask you one more question before we start hearing some weird excerpts from 2007.

I'll let you pick this one.

Give us another number between 1 and 20, please.

How about 9?

OK, 1, 2, 3.

Ah, a show you would erase from history.

You just did one you bring back.

A show you would just discard.

Everyone would forget about it.

Like in Men in Blackway, you hit the button, beep, and everyone's forgotten it exists.

What show would that be?

Well, immediately, I have to say the Big Bang Theory.

Now, I have to say I've never watched it, but I've seen enough of it, and I fucking hate it.

I hate the style of it, that 70s show, kind of late 90s, kind of cheap fucking multi-camera thing.

It's probably very funny.

People love it.

I know you're all gonna fucking kick off.

But I was working on a show backstage, and this person, they would just play it back to back to back to back.

And all I would hear is this terrible canned laughter, these non-jokes, this overacted, overcharacterization of like fucking Asian person.

I hated it.

I hate it.

I hate it.

I hate all of that stuff.

It should all go in the bin.

If I could get rid of one show, it would be that and the other show Young Sheldon, because one of my kids is showing interest in that.

And I cannot let that poison into my house.

So yes, the Big Bang Theory.

Everyone forget it, please.

Press the button now.

Okay, we'll do.

I'm in total agreement, obviously.

I don't have to be because I am you.

Touche.

Do you want another one straight away, or do you need to drink a water or something?

I can't drink water for the misophonia people, you know, the law will be right here.

Of course, yeah.

Let's not do that.

I don't want to hear a load of lip smacking on my ear, and in my ears either.

Okay, let's go with another one.

I'm just going to pull this one out the back.

What is the funniest thing you ever saw on TV?

You know what?

It's because I saw a clip of it recently, and I know it looks like it's from a hundred years ago, but Frank Spencer in Some Mothers Do Have Them, it's probably the first time I saw anything that was really, really funny on television.

I know it's 70s and it looks fucking ancient and all the, you know, women are caricatures and all that kind of thing.

But his physical comedy, Michael Crawford's physical comedy, when he's like, you know, on roller skates, going through a fucking removals van and out the other side and all the things that he does, it's a precursor to Bean.

It's a precursor to, you know, Jim Carrey.

Everything that he does is just absolutely brilliant.

I can't fault it, even now.

It's like I tried to show my wife it recently.

She's from Canada, she's in the East.

You know, British things in her childhood.

But, you know, I don't think it's that bad.

And, you know, I can't believe...

I told her, like, you know, that's the guy from, you know, Phantom of the Opera, right?

And she was like, what?

Anyway, I think he's brilliant.

I think Michael Crawford in that.

And even, I went to see him in this terrible film.

Where's the thing?

Film?

In 1982, when I was a kid, I went to the cinema on my own to see a film called Condorman.

And I thought it was going to be brilliant because he was in it.

And all I remember is he jumped off the Eiffel Tower wearing some sort of Victorian-type fake wings or something, trying to fly.

I can't remember what the story was.

But it was a load of shit.

I was very, very disappointed because I loved him and I loved Frank Spencer.

And I still think it holds up.

Someone's going to point out that it has all the wrong references in it and he's kind of gay but is he and he's not and all that sort of stuff.

I don't give a shit.

It's funny, funny, physical comedy.

End of.

First funny thing I saw, still makes me giggle.

I agree.

Totally agree.

It was so funny and yeah, I think a lot of people copied or definitely was heavily influenced by his physical comedy, without a doubt.

I have a funny story about Michael Crawford, if you'd like to hear it.

God, it's not bad, is it?

I mean, it's from the 70s.

No, no, no, no.

It's just a funny, it's like from a friend of a friend.

Okay, so I was in Australia in 2006, which I've mentioned before.

Sounds like I'm always talking about it at this point for some reason.

So we're in Sydney and suddenly the leading man of the show starts going out with the leading woman of the show.

They become a couple and he happens to have a friend who happens to be in Sydney.

This is Michael Crawford's daughter, so they hang out.

Now, the friend is talking to his friend who's Michael Crawford's daughter, you know, having a good laugh.

And then Michael Crawford comes over.

So now this woman who was playing the leading role, she turns to Michael Crawford and says, Oh, what do you do?

Are you in the business?

And of course the other two stories.

Wow, this is just fucking absolutely drop.

So that's all I've got.

That's all I've got.

That's funny, right?

That's really funny.

Yeah, that's so fucking awkward.

Oh, my God.

Could you imagine the shame of it all?

Not knowing who he was.

I guess he looks a bit different when he was older.

I mean, when was this?

2006, you said?

Yeah, but I mean, you know, if you work in theatre, you know who fucking Michael Crawford is, don't you?

Anyway, that's a really good choice.

Do you want another question straight away?

Yeah, I reckon.

Let's just keep the momentum going.

If that's what you can call this.

I think we can call this a mental breakdown.

Okay, pick a number, please.

Let's go for it again.

43.

No, I'm joking.

Seven.

I've just thought of a new question.

I'm just going to ask you this one.

Let's assume this is seven.

Okay.

What's a show that everyone else has probably seen that you haven't seen even one minute of?

Oh, man.

This is really funny you should say that, because I've just been recently thinking that it is weird that I haven't seen a single minute of Gogglebox.

I've never seen X Factor.

I've never seen Strictly Come Dancing.

I haven't seen even a second of it.

I haven't seen fucking any of the Pop Idol episodes from any country or any Britain's Got Talent or any other country's Got Alleged Talent.

I haven't seen any of it.

Even though I've worked with some of these people, I still haven't seen a fucking second of that stuff.

And I feel like I'm outside of the cultural zeitgeist sometimes.

There you go, zeitgeist again.

But it is just like, you know, everyone seems to know this stuff.

And when I listen to podcasts, there's always like a guest from one of these shows that I don't know who the fuck they are.

Or they have a celebrity edition or something on the BBC.

And I'm like, who?

I'm just out of it.

I feel like I watch so much TV, but still, I don't know who any of these people are.

It makes absolutely no sense.

It's like this other layer that sits over real life, that everyone else has tuned into, that I am just not picking up.

It's quite weird.

And I mean, I like it.

It's not a sort of badge of honour I'm trying to hold.

I'm sure having kids, that will definitely change in the future.

But it's just, I think it was because I never watched that sort of TV.

I always worked on Saturday Nights.

Never really saw that.

I wouldn't choose to watch something like that after the time it was screened.

That would be mad.

So yeah, I guess there's a bunch there to choose from.

But definitely Gogglebox.

I know everyone loves that.

There's one in Australia.

People love that shit.

But that idea of watching someone, that's the other thing.

Someone on Gogglebox is probably watching one of the other shows I haven't seen.

So I've got a fucking triple reference problem.

You know what I mean?

I don't know who these people were fucking watching it are.

I don't know what the fuck they're watching.

I don't know who they're referencing.

It would be, I'd just be like, I might as well just be watching something in Russian in like a fucking Vladivostok hotel room, you know, which I have done and understood even better.

In fact, once, I will tell you the story, shall I?

Shall I move into this?

Yeah, yeah, sure.

What's this about?

Well, it is a film.

It's a film for a start.

Okay, I'll do this.

There we go.

Again, how many times have you done that now?

Okay, off you go.

Right, so I'm in a weird hotel that's sort of somehow attached to a cliff in like Vladivostok, sort of built into the cliff somehow.

I was in the bottom room, like the bottom level.

And I don't want that, man.

And there was a channel of like DVD channel.

You know, we see the DVD bouncing off the corners.

So they had a channel in the TV, in the hotel room, sorry, that was tuned into this sort of dodgy pirate DVD channel standard.

And on it was white chicks.

I don't know if you've seen that.

It's a massively reverse racist TV.

Some would say.

And I have never seen it in English.

And I watched the entire thing in Russian.

Now, the thing is, on these pirate DVDs, they were in Russian, but you could just about hear the English underneath, very faint.

They didn't like get rid of the audio track.

They just had a Russian person talking over it.

One guy doing all the voices, literally everything.

And so basically I watched this film called White Chicks and I understood it perfectly well.

And I've never seen it.

And sort of I remember it, like the plot and everything.

I could work it out.

Didn't need a script.

Didn't need a script, guys.

It was that shit.

You could have just worked it out on the visuals.

So there we are.

That's my experience of watching a terrible film in a Russian hotel.

That has nothing to do with the original question.

Fair enough.

No, it's great.

Wherever this goes is great.

It doesn't matter.

You start at a point, you end up talking about watching a terrible Williams Brothers movie in a fucking hotel room in Russia.

I love it.

I love it.

How the hell we got from Gogglebox to Vladivostok?

That's a hell of a swerve.

But you know, I love it.

I love it.

Let's move on.

Maybe if you name these episodes, you should call that one, you know, Gogglebox to Vladivostok, but I guess you don't do that.

Well, you know, you can leave that to me.

I'm the host after all.

It's nothing to do with you.

But yeah, normally I use the guest name, but as the guest name is yourself or me, it's going to be a bit tricky, isn't it?

I guess we'll work that out in a little while.

Anyway, you up for one more question?

Oh, is this the last one?

Is it?

Well, I think we're pushing it at this point, aren't we?

Yeah, maybe.

Okay, let's just do one more.

I'll give you a number and you can tell me what that number is.

I'll just guess.

Let's do it the other way around.

So I'm going to say, can I have question number four, please?

Sure.

Question number four.

What popular genre of TV are you most surprised by?

To be honest, I'm mostly surprised by your pronunciation of the word genre.

Well, you know, like as a kid, if I was thinking about TV in the future, I definitely wouldn't think the things that are on now would be those things.

There's all people dancing in future sort of weird tinfoil suits to like weird electronic music.

Maybe, I don't know what the future TV would be like, Battle Royale or something.

Instead, it's just like, I don't know, people in tents baking cakes or people making cakes that look like fucking basketballs or handbags.

It's really nuts.

I can't really understand what's happening.

And it's even like the food and drink thing has infiltrated into my children's lives, like, you know, the prime drink, you know, they were obsessed with the drink or a certain hot fucking tortilla chip or whatever.

It's all food based, a lot of food based stuff, a lot of cooking shows, a lot of baking shows, a lot of competition shows to do with cooking.

You know, I would never have thought that this was what the future would be like.

And it sort of started a while ago, right?

And it just keeps going, gets bigger and bigger and bigger.

I can't understand it.

I mean, I like some of them.

It's fine.

I'll watch Kitchen Nightmares.

Some of Gordon Ramsay's stuff is fun, but, you know, it's getting a bit fucking old, to be honest with you, all that swearing, a bit tired, deliberately being horrible.

But I just, just would never have guessed that this is what the future would be like.

People making fucking cakes and guessing if things were made of cake.

That's literally it.

That's the 2020 so far.

It's so weird.

It is weird.

It really is weird.

I wouldn't have thought so either.

Well, Steve, I think I'm going to end it here between you and me, if that's okay.

Thank you so much for coming on and giving your insight.

It's been a real pleasure.

And hopefully, you know, I'll speak to you again soon.

I'll see you a little bit later.

Click in about two minutes.

Yeah, absolutely.

Okay, see you later.

Cheers, mate.

Well, that was pretty weird, I think you'll agree.

Some kind of psychotic break happening there, maybe?

It was fun.

Haven't had anyone else do it, so, shut the fuck up.

Okay, as promised, let's have a little delve into the podcast that I recorded at the High Wycombe Swan Theatre back in 2007.

It was backstage with a couple of friends, Woody Woodcock and Dom Clements, and we were chatting about this weird idea.

Again, we haven't been listening to many podcasts because they weren't that many around in 2007, but there's some massive echoes of light with Holistapo, which came slightly after.

Not claiming anything there, we must have got the idea from somewhere, but it wasn't part of the normal podcast realm at this point.

So let's delve backstage into the Swan Theatre in High Wycombe at some point in early 2007.

And I hope you enjoy the sort of radio sound effects that I was kind of going for.

They're a bit ridiculous now.

Of the Week.

OK, here's the discussion.

Welcome to Dom.

Hello.

And myself.

Well, today's discussion is the quandary as to whether you'd like to be hit with one stick a thousand times or a thousand sticks all at once.

I personally would like to be hit with a thousand sticks at once.

I kind of like things to get done with, don't I?

However...

Sorry, sorry.

No, no, no, I was just going to say, it's a bit like when you climb stairs.

Are you a one-step person or do you bound up?

Well, you can't come up all the stairs at the same time, can you?

In all honesty, a flight of stairs does involve more than one step, I think you'd find.

Unless it's a step.

Yeah, but that's not a flight of stairs, surely.

That's a flight of stairs, surely.

Stairs, yeah.

Sorry, it's a plural thing, isn't it?

I personally, I reckon I'd go with the one stick a thousand...

Well, think how long you're going to be there if you have one stick a thousand times.

You're going to lose, like, a whole...

But if you have a thousand sticks hit you at once, you will die.

Not necessarily, because the question that neither of us have asked...

How big is the stick?

How big is the stick and who is wielding the sticks?

Is it a lolly stick with a child?

Indeed, or it could be Buddhist monk with a big, thick log.

That's a phrase I never thought I'd say today.

I mean, don't be shy.

I've actually changed my fence, is it right?

Oh, really?

I didn't realise you were sitting on to me.

I was.

It was very painful.

But you want it all done together, don't you?

Don't kick the mic.

I didn't kick the mic.

All right, we could all just try to get along.

Day one of a podcast, things aren't going quite as well as planned.

But, you know, there's no right or wrong answer to it.

It's a, you know, it's a point of...

Whereabouts are we being hit?

Well, that's the other thing.

You see, if you get hit with the 1,000 stick, one stick 1,000 times, rather, and that's on the same area of your body, that's going to really start to smile after a while, I think.

And it would depend where you get hit.

And if you get hit by 1,000 sticks at the same time, they're all hitting you in different places, therefore you get 1,000 injuries.

And also, if you're being hit with 1,000 sticks at once, can all 1,000 sticks hit you?

For instance, if it's a thick stick, that's, you know, say the stick is...

Sticks may actually hit each other, therefore you're better off, you're more likely to get hit by, say, 400 sticks.

Whereas if it's a tiny switch of a stick, should we say, that's going to be...

Cocktail stick's painful, though.

That's a prod, that's not a hit.

Ah, now we can get into those kind of words.

Prod, hit.

What's the difference between a prod and a hit?

A hit's a...

This is pointless, cos it's a microphone, no-one can see.

A hit is a...

But...

Is that, and a prod.

A prod is a...

that.

I think a prod could also be described as a poke.

Prod and a poke.

Prod and a poke.

Although is there a difference between a prod and a poke?

Clearly I don't know.

Well, a poke involves a hole.

Not necessarily.

I could get my finger and poke...

But you create a hole of sorts around the flesh.

Well, only if you've got really, like, paper-thin flesh, I'm going to put holes in you.

That's insane.

I don't know.

But you create an inverse, wouldn't you?

Hello, we've moved on to big words all of a sudden.

You see, I would have said that a prod was poking the sentient being, as you were, rather than an animate object.

But I don't know.

All of this is open to...

It's like, what's the difference between a push and a shove?

Indeed.

I would say the shove is much more violent.

Whereas a push could almost be accidental.

A nudge.

Nudge.

Well, nudge can almost be conspiratorial, as well, can't it?

As in the old aforementioned nudge-nudge wink with Charlie Gale.

A shove-shove would have the same meaning, wouldn't it?

But, you know, life is what it is.

Poking and prodding.

So, to summarise, I think I'd go with...

To end this ridiculous discussion.

I would end...

I think I would go with a thousand sticks at once, because I reckon there would be a lot of deflection.

Absolutely.

Well...

You've said so anyway.

I would go for that, and I feel it's a little bit crap that we've all gone for the same thing.

It is a bit shit, so the vote for this one is...

I'd rather be hit with a thousand sticks at once than...

One stick a thousand times.

Goodbye.

Thanks.

OK, so that's the end of the second Sogcast.

Hope you enjoyed the bizarreness of that.

Well, that's all a bit weird, isn't it?

That I am saying tune in 16 years ago and I'm using high pitched funny voices.

So that was always going to happen, was it?

It was always there.

It was always deep down, ready to go whenever the podcast came back.

Oh well, there you go.

So I had no idea what I was doing.

We had no idea what we were doing.

That was just a bit of fun.

Now to the outro track.

It's a nice short episode for you guys this week, but the outro track is long.

This is my opportunity.

I've been looking for an opportunity to put this long bad boy in.

So in 1999, I wrote a song about the entire 20th century and I tagged on an extra line for up to 9-11, I think.

And anyway, it took me a very long time.

It was very complicated.

I did not own a computer.

This was all done using an old Atari and a bunch of instruments.

I don't even know how I did it.

I can't even remember.

When I listen to it now, I just think, how the fuck did I do that?

I have no idea.

I remember writing it.

So I have a song in the late 90s called 21st Century Overkill, like people banging on about how different it was going to be in the 21st century.

And this is called 20th Century Underkill, as if we were sort of making out that it wasn't represented enough, the old 20th century.

So the lyrics are somewhere.

I'll try and dig them out.

Maybe I'll put them online.

But there's basically an event or phrase to represent every single year of the 20th century.

I mean, I really still don't understand why I put this thing together with the equipment that I had and the knowledge and talent I had at the time.

No idea.

But I think you'll agree there's a lot going on.

There's a lot of ideas.

So here we go.

20th century on the kill.

So that was 20th Century Underkill there.

What do you think of that, Steve?

I think it was pretty good.

Yeah, I mean, you know, it's a product of its time, but you know, there's a lot of information going on.

There's a lot of things happening.

Yeah, and I like quite a lot of the music in it.

I like that bit around the Saigon bit.

I've always loved that.

It was a nice little tune.

Yeah, really nice.

Could go in a musical, couldn't it, really?

I mean, it's like a musical.

It's almost like act one in one go.

Anyway, I think we should say goodbye.

I've taken the piss at this point, have we?

Yeah, I think we might be, actually.

Okay, in that case, it's goodbye from me and it's goodbye from him.

Classic.

And remember, guys, there's no team in Steve.

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